dialation...cha cha cha

[shubedo]

Yep, you saw it right...dialated pouch and a total unfill. The cause? I think it has been a variety of things. My band has not been quite "right" since last fall. By this I mean the restriction I felt after surgery with just a little in the band was always consistant. I typicly ate the same amount each time with no problem and was successfully losing weight.

Closer to December, it began to change a bit in that first thing in the morning it was difficult to get anything down (protein shakes even caught up a time or two) but by the evening I felt (and ate) like I was not banded. Weightloss slowed MAJORLY just after the first of the year and they gave me a fill. That was in February and I have only lost around 10 lbs since then.

In that time since there was a MAJOR PB involving some apple peel and cheese (ugly UGLY situation) and then all hell broke loose. I had a little unfill to let things settle. Yesterday I had a quick bite to eat before my appointment (they always insisted it was fine to do) and we could see all my food on the flouroscope. The doc was actually glad I had eaten so he could really see (and show me) how distorted my pouch was. He unfilled me ( I was a big girl and did not cry...on the outside anyway) and said we would see how things are in a month.

Now...here is the thing. My docs (two in the partnership) have told me that the newest rule (and this was before my trouble began) is to only eat 3oz. at a sitting. If I am still hungry, I must wait an hour then I can have another 3oz. They say I can do that whenever I need to, but to keep myself at 3oz faithfully. They want me to stick with this even now! They said it is my only chance to try to correct the dialation. Sigh... Does this sound weird to anyone? Has anyone heard of this? Why wouldn't I just try for liquids and mushies right now?

I am so scared I will not be able to do this for a month. I am self pay and there is no way I can afford a corrective surgery right now (just bought a mini van 3 days ago). I am frustrated, scared and unsure and trying so hard to remain positive!

Jess...I'm right there with you, girl!!!

Cindy

[SteffiLee]

Hey there, Cuz! I am so sorry to hear how things are going! How frustrating! Do you think all of us should be eating only 3 oz at a time? Or was that just because of the dilation? I will keep checking this thread to see what others have to say. Hang in there! Love ya', Steff

[shubedo]

Hey there, Cuz! I am so sorry to hear how things are going! How frustrating! Do you think all of us should be eating only 3 oz at a time? Or was that just because of the dilation? I will keep checking this thread to see what others have to say. Hang in there! Love ya', Steff

My docs say we should all do it. I have yet to hear or read about that anywhere else. Let me tell you...it BITES! Those times when you are a bit looser and trying to survive on 3oz. ...it's like being on the diet circuit all over again...starving on those tiny amounts of food. Grrrr!!! Maybe it's better when you are at the sweet spot.

I'm glad to see things are going well for you! Keep it up girl! I'm thinking we may need to go someplace our former "selves" would not have gone before! Let's ponder that...could be fun!

Cindy

[PhotoNut]

First of all... *big hugs* Everything's going to be ok. So try not to stress yourself out. I know, easier said than done huh? *more hugs*

It's very interesting that you brought up the 3oz thing. I've been dwelling on the multiple cases of dialation and slipped bands we've been seeing lately, and far in the back of my mind I've been hearing the words "Your pouch will hold 1/2 to 1 cup of food." Um.. hello. Over the past year, I -know- I eat more than that at a time. It's gradually increased to more like 2 cups.

We always talk about getting back to basics. Maybe it's time we ALL took a step back and really looked at where we are now compared to where we were when we first started on solid foods again (post surgery). I would imagine that tightening the band isn't going to make the pouch smaller. If it's stretched out, it's still going to hold more and a tighter band is only going to cause PBs and possibly end up with a slipped band.

You hang in there, Happy Pants. You can eat 3oz every hour if you want. Just be sure to eat lots of good lean protein.

I'm going to keep thinking on this, and I'm really interested to hear other bandsters thoughts.

[shubedo]

First of all... *big hugs* Everything's going to be ok. So try not to stress yourself out. I know, easier said than done huh? *more hugs*

It's very interesting that you brought up the 3oz thing. I've been dwelling on the multiple cases of dialation and slipped bands we've been seeing lately, and far in the back of my mind I've been hearing the words "Your pouch will hold 1/2 to 1 cup of food." Um.. hello. Over the past year, I -know- I eat more than that at a time. It's gradually increased to more like 2 cups.

We always talk about getting back to basics. Maybe it's time we ALL took a step back and really looked at where we are now compared to where we were when we first started on solid foods again (post surgery). I would imagine that tightening the band isn't going to make the pouch smaller. If it's stretched out, it's still going to hold more and a tighter band is only going to cause PBs and possibly end up with a slipped band.

You hang in there, Happy Pants. You can eat 3oz every hour if you want. Just be sure to eat lots of good lean protein.

I'm going to keep thinking on this, and I'm really interested to hear other bandsters thoughts.


This is so true! I wonder if along the way I kept thinking...I'm ok...I can do one more bite...and it just added up. Maybe that full signal changes along the way. Mine used to be hiccups but that has not happened in a while. I think I have been beating myself up a little...thinking in the deep recesses of my mind, great...just one more "diet" that I have failed at. Hopefully my optimistic nature will override it.

And the happy pants saying...You can get happy in the same pants you get mad in! It's time for me to apply that full force!

Peanut, maybe we need to start a portion size thread to see if there is a link. THANKS so much for always being there for ALL of us!

Cindy

[PhotoNut]

Peanut, maybe we need to start a portion size thread to see if there is a link. THANKS so much for always being there for ALL of us!

I think you're right!
And you're welcome! :sun_smiley:

[WildAlaskaG'ma]

Sorry to hear of your complication ,,, but feel confident that "this too shall pass ,,," Hang in, girlfriend. Keep sorting out the bumps that got you where you are ,,, and keep posting so we can all learn from your situation ,,, Scream to us whenever you need to !!! Hugggs ,,,

[bgrand]

Thanks for sharing. I do stick to the 1 cup rule. Couldn't eat more than that if I wanted to and can't really eat a cup full. It's more like 1/2 to 3/4 cup.
I also, wait 1-2 hours before eating anything else, and that worries me as well. I thought at the conference we were told to do 3 meals a day and 2 snacks only if you need to have it. If I remember correctly, eating often is just as bad as eating to much, because it doesn't allow the pouch to empty.
Anyone have feedback on this?

[Patrick]

Small portions, a little more frequently that just 3x daily makes sense. Just think about what she said about eating just that 1 or 2 bites extra, which very easily can start to stretch the pouch.
By smaller portions more frequently, I have not suggesting 8 meals a day, but how about 4 or maybe even 5 spread out equally. That still leave plenty of time to digest each smaller portion. The body will adapt to your eating style over time and you would adjust to it and become comfortable with it, given some patience.
This is the sort of information that we all should pay attention to. This band life is still in its infancy, and practical experience plays a lot more into it that just doctors orders. After all, they are all practicing doctors.
Thanks for bringing this up Cindy, and sharing your experience. This might help several banders avoid this if they are in similiar situations. I am particularly wondering if my eating habits are setting me up for something like this. I am going to try different eating habits and see how I feel.

[Nick N Ava's Grammy]

I'm paying attention to this thread, and I'm gonna subscribe to it too .. just to keep an eye on what everyone thinks. This is very important I think to learn from this..

Cindy.. I'm so sorry this has happened, but I sure do appreciate you telling your story so we can learn from your experience. (and I hope I'm not offending you.. it's not my intention) hugssss

[MoOrLess]

Cindy - HUGS - you CAN do this girl -- unfortunately, once again - we need a "head" band I think - it would sure help me!

I agree on eating SMALL meals -- honestly, portion has never been my personal issue - it has been choices. That said, I don't eat more than 1 cup of food at one time, ever. Before fills I ate less than 1 cup, since fills, I definitely eat less than 1 cup of food at a time. I DO eat more frequently (sometimes) if I am still hungry, but I find it takes 2 hours to feel hungrier. Either I am blessed with a small stomach because I never could eat much and my family always wondered why I weighed what I did pre-banded, OR my head has been in 'band mode' for a long time and I just won't eat more than 1 cup.

So all this to say - P'nut, yes, please start a thread about how MUCH we eat. I think it would be really helpful for everyone. Definitely a back to basics mentality.

[ginabobina]

so sorry to hear this! I hope your tummy will heal up and resituate itself.

I too have been wondering about the increase in complications among our members here, which I'm sure is partly just a statistical necessity as the site continues to grow. That being said, I totally agree that it would be helpful for us ALL to kick up the monitoring on portion sizes. I rarely weight or measure anything and go by feeling full instead. I think if i go back to eating a specific amount and let that be that whether I have a full signal or not, that could only help. When I started solids i used a ziploc or Glad brand reusable serving container that was 1 cup... I could put my food in there and know how much I was eating.

[shubedo]

Thanks for sharing. I do stick to the 1 cup rule. Couldn't eat more than that if I wanted to and can't really eat a cup full. It's more like 1/2 to 3/4 cup.
I also, wait 1-2 hours before eating anything else, and that worries me as well. I thought at the conference we were told to do 3 meals a day and 2 snacks only if you need to have it. If I remember correctly, eating often is just as bad as eating to much, because it doesn't allow the pouch to empty.
Anyone have feedback on this?

I also wonder about getting in enough protein. If you have 3 oz. for meals, it would have to be pure protein I would think.

[MoOrLess]

yep was thinking about that too Cindy - obviously 3 oz meals means SOLIDS and not liquids -- re: protein shake - mine is 8 oz and I can drink that even with good restriction with my 5th and most recent fill. But then again -- 3 oz is NOT all that much - and nowhere near a CUP of food - so if you eat often, you can eat 3 oz protein, then the next time 3 oz veggies, then the next time 3 oz carbs ??? perhaps.....

[shubedo]

Thanks to everyone for your concern and well wishes. I do not mind one little bit sharing all of this with you. Docs can only do so much. It is up to us to really learn how to use (and not use) the band. I have learned so much from this site and I am happy to be able to contribute! My biggest concern right now is the HUNGER! 3 oz. was ok for breakfast...and I'm having some soup now that will hopefully go down easily. I have decided that if it is a more solid food, I will limit myself to 3 oz. If it is soup or liquid/mushie I will limit it to no more than a cup. I will also try VERY hard to make good choices. I'm thinking I am going to take advantage of this and have some of the WONDERFUL produce that is in season right now. Normally that can be hard for me to negotiate with the band.
Yeah, me! I figured out a positive in the situation! lol

Cindy

[newlifeat57]

Thanks Cindy for sharing. The subject about amounts has been on my mind lately as I have been reading about the troubles many have been having. Since I'm fairly new, there is no time like NOW to start monitoring, and keep monitoring my amounts. Thanks again. Now onward to the new thread on amounts.....

Best wishes....

[jules]

I'm new to this chat forum__but I posted a question about a dialated pouch this morning too. My doctor (University of Minnesota) has told me that I should only be eating 1/2 a cup of food 3x's a day. There hasn't been any way I could do that__complete fasting would be easier.

If we don't have enough restriction isn't our food just going to pass through quickly and easily enough so that a couple of hours later we'll be hungry again?

I'm just wondering --are you all satisfied with that small amount of food?? I'm just not getting the satiety I thought I would from the band and I fear dialation too.

["Just Jess"]

Jess...I'm right there with you, girl!!!

oh cindy --- just catching up with this now. sorry to hear of what's going on, but obviously - i empathize!

so, your doc told you 3 oz a meal - even now?? my doc told me - you're planning a wedding, do your very best, keep exercising, we'll give your band 2 weeks and take another look at it and see if can't give you a little fill back. i wonder if that is bc i was so obviously stressed - shuold i only be having 3 oz. at a sitting?! wow. i def. have more than that. even before being unfilled. i easily ate a cup of food. and sometimes i WANTED more - even though i couldn't/shouldn't.......

you'll be in my thoughts - we'll get through this together... me, you, shel, and betty. the unfilled sistas of b2g. :faint:

[SteffiLee]

Hey folks- You all are posting such good information! Cousin, I'm sorry it took your bad experience to help us all. I am thinking I will not go by the full feeling so much anymore because that can be a head game- I am definitely guilty of just one more bite- just one more bite- that is what got me to being overweight in the first place. So, I think for some of us feeling full is not a good method. I will need to go by the 3 oz solid and a little more liquid rule. Cindy, have you thought of doing protein bullets? They are 3 oz with 45 grams of protein. Would anyone else recommend this? Love ya, Cuz- PS- I want us to go on a cruise with the kids!

["Just Jess"]

did your doc recommend a liquid or mushie diet or any stipulations during this time unfilled?? i was thinking of doing liquids for the rest of today and tomorrow in preparation for my UGI/checkup on Thursday morning...

[Gabrielle]

I am also a little newby-ish and am very freaked out by a dilated pouch. Was just going over my meals that last couple of days and wondering if I have been eating more than a cup and wondering how many "one more bites" would it take to stretch your pouch? I mean sometimes I say, just one more bite, but not that often, am totally going to start paying much closer attention and the 1 cup ziplock thing is brilliant!! I was just realizing I ate like 1/2 of a little baby H20 melon last night, that is way more than a cup!! I hope I am not doomed!!

[Halo]

I'm going for my one year check up on Friday. I was wanting to get a fill but I believe my pouch may be dilated too. Agghh!! I have the "first bite syndrome". Sometimes the first bite I take feels stuck...up high like at the top of my esophagus. Does anyone else get that up high stuck feeling? Once it passes through (like a boa constrictor is digesting a rat) I can then eat with no problem and too much food at that. This is frustrating....I guess I need to do the 3 oz thing too. My general practioner thinks I may need a fluro to see if it is my esophogus and not my band. I did have to have my esophogus stretched once before lap band surgery.

[shubedo]

I am also a little newby-ish and am very freaked out by a dilated pouch. Was just going over my meals that last couple of days and wondering if I have been eating more than a cup and wondering how many "one more bites" would it take to stretch your pouch? I mean sometimes I say, just one more bite, but not that often, am totally going to start paying much closer attention and the 1 cup ziplock thing is brilliant!! I was just realizing I ate like 1/2 of a little baby H20 melon last night, that is way more than a cup!! I hope I am not doomed!!

Yes, it is easy to over do. I really think measuring is the key!


Thanks Cindy for sharing. The subject about amounts has been on my mind lately as I have been reading about the troubles many have been having. Since I'm fairly new, there is no time like NOW to start monitoring, and keep monitoring my amounts. Thanks again. Now onward to the new thread on amounts.....

Best wishes....

Thanks and good luck to you!


I'm new to this chat forum__but I posted a question about a dialated pouch this morning too. My doctor (University of Minnesota) has told me that I should only be eating 1/2 a cup of food 3x's a day. There hasn't been any way I could do that__complete fasting would be easier.

If we don't have enough restriction isn't our food just going to pass through quickly and easily enough so that a couple of hours later we'll be hungry again?

I'm just wondering --are you all satisfied with that small amount of food?? I'm just not getting the satiety I thought I would from the band and I fear dialation too.

Yes, it has been VERY difficult. I have not stuck with the 3 oz very well but I know that if I don't get enough to eat I am gonna cheat! I have decided that having a healthy choice that is bigger is better than eating garbage all day long. I have also tried drinking with meals again...like during the mushie stage...to make sure things move along to my "old" stomach to give my "pocket" a break. I have not gained at all so it must be working alright.


oh cindy --- just catching up with this now. sorry to hear of what's going on, but obviously - i empathize!

so, your doc told you 3 oz a meal - even now?? my doc told me - you're planning a wedding, do your very best, keep exercising, we'll give your band 2 weeks and take another look at it and see if can't give you a little fill back. i wonder if that is bc i was so obviously stressed - shuold i only be having 3 oz. at a sitting?! wow. i def. have more than that. even before being unfilled. i easily ate a cup of food. and sometimes i WANTED more - even though i couldn't/shouldn't.......

you'll be in my thoughts - we'll get through this together... me, you, shel, and betty. the unfilled sistas of b2g. :faint:

Yep! 3oz even NOW! See above as to what I have been doing. There is NO way. I tried for a few days and it was not gonna happen. Unfilled Sistas...lol...sounds like one of those girls gone wild titles! lol


Hey folks- You all are posting such good information! Cousin, I'm sorry it took your bad experience to help us all. I am thinking I will not go by the full feeling so much anymore because that can be a head game- I am definitely guilty of just one more bite- just one more bite- that is what got me to being overweight in the first place. So, I think for some of us feeling full is not a good method. I will need to go by the 3 oz solid and a little more liquid rule. Cindy, have you thought of doing protein bullets? They are 3 oz with 45 grams of protein. Would anyone else recommend this? Love ya, Cuz- PS- I want us to go on a cruise with the kids!

I have been drinking a shake every day and eating a protein bar for breakfast (have been in BIST discipline training all week for school). I'm doing ok now that I'm not stressing over the 3 oz. thing. Just getting in the water when I eat is easing things...and I really have not had a meal of over 8 oz. Hopefully it will do the trick. Cruise sounds great! If it's one of those that entertains the kids so we can do OUR thing! Tee Hee Yes, I'm selfish! lol


did your doc recommend a liquid or mushie diet or any stipulations during this time unfilled?? i was thinking of doing liquids for the rest of today and tomorrow in preparation for my UGI/checkup on Thursday morning...

Only the 3 oz. thing. The only reason my doc found the dialation was because I had some food in my pouch and he could see it. Maybe you should call and see what they want you to do. I am anxious to hear your results! I'm keeping all appendages crossed!

[sharont81]

This is what I am going through. I can see the 3 oz. many times a day. I am sorry that you had to go through this to get some ansers. I am like you, there is no book that works for everyone with the band - it is a lesson along the way. I am back to protein shakes in the morning, and SMALL amounts of food. I am waiting to get unfilled. Sometimes the feeling of food stuck is so unpleasant and can hurt. Trying to find that spot that is right - let us know what happens with you. Hang in there!!

[SteffiLee]

Hey cousin- what is BIST? Back in School Training? Booty is Sexy Tonight training?

[shubedo]

Alrighty...The update.

I have been out of town for a while and eating like a crazy woman. The three ounce thing while unfilled...YEAH RIGHT!!! It just gave me permission to snack my way through the day. I just wanted EAT EAT EAT!!! My appointment was not until August 15 but I called and asked to get in early...Success! I got in yesterday.

Everything was looking good on the flouroscope so he decided to give me a fill. I drank more barium and it all flowed just fine so all is well...problem corrected! WHEW!

Now...he did give me a VERY interesting visual that I would like to share. He described the food we eat as slurrie (think about wet cement). Some of the slurrie is liquid, some is bits of rock. When we begin pouring the slurrie into our pouch, some of the liquid goes through first then the bits of rock begin getting caught up in the pouch. More bits are caught and a plug of sorts forms...the pouch fills with the remaining bits of rock.
If we think of this when we eat, we can help control that full feeling. If we eat liquid"ie" foods (soup), it will take MUCH longer to form that plug since we are constantly mixing in more liquid with the rocks. If we eat the rocks to begin with, we are better off. Meat is a rock. So is heavy food such as pasta and bread. Some examples he gave...

Eat almost 3oz of salad with balsalmic vinegar (you don't want the dressing "lube"). At the very end, eat a bite of bread. The bread will act as the final "filling" rock and keep you full much longer.

If you need a small snack to get you through, try 1/3 of a banana. Once again...very little if any liquid and it creates a rock.

Oatmeal for breakfast...3oz of cooked oatmeal...but overcook it...just until most of the liquid is soaked up. It should be more solid.

He feels that if you have to "lube" your food or feel the need to take a drink or two, you are too tight. If you can eat three ounces of very dry, firm food (like a well done steak) and still feel that you need more, you are not tight enough.

He also mentioned the "sign" to stop. I told him mine was the hiccups. He responded that if I get the hiccups, I have already eaten too much. I have eaten enough to irritate the diaphram.

So, this is much like starting over for me. He was able to get a good part of the liquid back in the band but not quite what I had. Hopefully I am on the road to the elusive sweet spot!

And...CUZ! BIST is Behavior Intervention Strategy Team...nothing near as quirky as one might hope!

Cheers to all!

Cindy

[Dustbunny]

Sounds good. Happy Band Day! DB

[MoOrLess]

Hooray -- so glad that things are back on track!

[chrispygal]

Great news Cindy - and great pointers!

[sassy46545]

I loved the imagery of the cement, water, rocks etc.. It makes a very strong point for why we're always told to eat the solid protein FIRST, not only to get in the required amount but also to create the "rocks" that slow the passing of food into the larger part of the stomach and therefore keeping us satisfied with smaller portions.
As for the "3 oz" rule...my surgeon told us to eat 1-2 cups of food at a sitting, which would become about 1/2 to 1 cup of CHEWED food in the banded area.

Quantities get out of control sooooo quickly.....I've got to get the scale out and start measuring again...I get lazy just eye-balling the portions!

Tracy

[shubedo]

Thanks everyone for the well wishes!

Tracy, isn't is amazing the difference in what our docs tell us? 3oz is a bit of a bear, but I noticed this morning that if I really ate the solid stuff, that was all I could handle. Strange...